I am using the free version of the app. I’m sure i am missing something obvious, but how do i save workspaces out of Shapr3d, and then load them back in? i.e. how do i use Shapr to make more than 3 projects? or is it the case that I am not missing anything and you have to actually delete your work once you have made 3 projects in Shapr?
In the free version you can’t. It is limited to 3 workspaces. If you want to make a new, you will have to delete one.
ahh … that stinks. it seriously reduces the utility of the app for a hobbyist. I would suggest to any moderators who see this thread to offer a lower fee with the low res file type save capability. I can’t justify the full app, but am unlikely to use the app if i can only ever make 3 items with it (and want to be able to revisit what i worked on).
One good reason that I can think of why this is not done is I paid the subscription price and, like many people, feel we get excellent response to our questions and issues from the developers. Compare that to the apps that offer free or near-free versions where the forums invariably get flooded with questions and frequently with grumbling about having to pay more than $3 from the many who always seem to want everything their way and for free to the point where those of us who paid the full price must suffer from reduced service and perhaps less product development because the developers can’t keep up to the barrage. I probably would not have made this comment if you had not started with your very unfair ‘that stinks’ comment. Developers need to eat too and don’t magically become rich just because they are developers and no, I have no direct or indirect connection to these guys - I’m just saying that from the perspective of someone who has paid for the subscription, I don’t want the forum to become flooded in this way or for the developers to lose interest because they can’t make a decent living.
Oh – i didn’t mean to imply that it “stinks” like “screw those guys.” It “stinks” insofar as this is a very useful looking app, but it doesn’t have a basic feature I need to start using it. like “aww shucks, thats disappointing.” If i have to erase something i worked on and tweaked for 10 or 20 hours, that’s basically useless. its a severe discouragement to build anything more complicated than a few simple boxes.
And i pay subscriptions for lots of apps, pay for lots of in app upgrades, and would gladly pay a subscription for a “consumer” grade of this one. But I’m not a CAD engineer – i’m a guy with a mid-grade 3d printer in his garage. So for me, i would pay something more than 0, but something less than 300.00/year to access the ability to save low-quality meshes and be able to recall them. just that one simple feature. But the way the pricing is designed, I won’t buy into this ecosystem.
so, far from trying to offend you, i was trying to offer useful market information to the developers. It might be that they don’t need my money or the money from people like me. but it also might be the case that they are trying to figure out how to pick off more low hanging fruit — people who would give them money, but at a lower price point and for less features. So, my contribution could help them.
Also – another idea based on your comment. If high-level service is valuable to you, you could be eligible for private support fora at the premium price, and leave the the free-tier in a free forum, and put the mid-grade subscribers in a “we will get to you in a week or so” forum.
In the end, a properly tailored scheme of price discrimination can benefit everyone — so long as your business model can support it.
It doesn’t “stink” at all but you do have a point that a pricing structure with an additional middle tier might benefit the company and users like you.
I have found that the more I use shapr, the more utility it offers – so one’s price perception might change? And the support is hyper-responsive…
you are correct, it does not literally “stink” as it is just an expression meant to convey disappointment and “it” does not have physical properties capable of emitting odor.
however, with that aside, i think its reasonable to say, as you note, that some middle-tier pricing for less support, less features, but still at a level where the developers can make some money by drawing in marginal users is not a terrible idea.
I think Shapr is a nice program and really easy to use, but… I haven’t used it as much as I thought I would when I bought it. I realise that developers have to eat - but so have the rest of us. Due to the subscription model (which I have never liked, sorry…) the program is becoming more expensive than, for instance, Rhino - while having just a fraction of the features (yet).
For most people Rhino isn’t an option, of course. It doesn’t work on the iPad and is a bit more complicated (except for someone who’s been using it for 21 years ).
I realise that this sounds a bit negative, but I’m sure the developers appreciate an honest opinion from a design professional. I still like Shapr though… Peace
to be clear, i don’t have a problem necessarily with a subscription model (assuming a company regularly updates an app) … and i’m happy to pay for products i use. the point of my thread is that for me (and other people who might be like me) there would need to be some intermediate price point in order to make Shapr make sense.
it looks like a fantastic program, its just too high a price point for the one extra thing i need (to be able to export models i can later reimport).
The Shapr staff listen and have always been responsive so there is always hope. It is often difficult for a young company to do everything at once. Often patience wins out…
Peace and harmony to all,
Amazing app! Lots of respect to creators! But, yes, I don‘t see how this price model will scale for hobbyist designers… why not let people buy credit points? E.g. 10$ for additional workspace? 5$ for letting them print in a higher quality? I have a feeling that will appeal to more and scale much better. The recurring 300$ fee is barely acceptable for a hobbyist, no matter how good is the app. There are alternatives, even though not for an iPad yet, but it‘s a matter of time. Many thanks again, for a great app!
If you are interested, I am happy to give you industry insights on why all the “hobbyist CAD” products failed. Eg. Autodesk cancelled 123D, and they are not making any money on TinkerCAD (one of our investors btw. was the founder of TinkerCAD). It’s not possible to build a sustainable business for that niche.
Most likely a fair point. But I wonder where all these ever increasing 3D printer owners fit in? For most of them a product like AutoCAD is too complex. I personally think these 3D printer hobbyists are more likely be your app users rather than a professional CAD designer switching to an iPad app? In a long term probably yes though. But you need cash flows and the market now. iOS in-app purchases offer you that opportunity to pick these low hanging fruits…
Out of meer curiosity - what is your target audience?
No, most of our customers are not 3D printing hobbyists (I would say ~90%+ of them are not). We are targeting professionals. Shaper is running on the same tech stack as SolidWorks (we use the same modeling engine, Parasolid, and soon the same sketch engine D-Cubed). The value proposition is that you can work faster, and we give you more freedom, without the mental overhead that legacy CAD systems have.
The industry experience is that 3D printing hobbyists can not be monetized. Many tried, all of them failed. 95% of them don’t want to pay for their software.
Of course I mean that 90%+ of the paying customers are not hobbyists. Lot of people are using the free version for 3D printing of course. That’s one of the reasons why we have a free version.
OK, get you. Thanks. Its easier to work with professional sector. They at least mostly know what they want
Also, don’t get me wrong. We have tremendous respect for 3D printing hobbyists. I am one too. We have an ultimaker in the office and we love it. It’s just you can’t build a CAD business on that segment.
in terms of monetizing hobbyists - i dont know the market and can only speak to my own experience. But in case its useful for planning the future of Shapr:
i happily pay for creative apps that i use. In fact, if the price is marginally attractive ill usually just buy an app and if it doesnt work out move on with my life. I subscribe to multiple creative software packages.
i don’t pay for the professional levels, both because its usually too expensive for what i want to do with them and also because i usually don’t need all the features. For example, i bought Astropad but didn’t but the Astropad pro version.
— i DID however buy their luna dongle when they made one – so someone like me is upgradable.
the right price for me for this kind of app is something like a one-time 30.00 charge to be able to export and import different file types (even low res). or a 10.00 per month fee for unlimited in app storage.
so given all that, umake seems to have the right price. Its harder to use than Shapr so i might not buy it if i cant get a hang of its work flow, but its got that basic import /export for 10.00/month for what i need. Worst case scenario, ill just keep using the desktop tools i have.
thanks for listening!
What I think is being suggested, is that you all seem to already have a CAD business based on the professional sector, so why not add a “prosumer” tier that is halfway between the 2, and gain the perks of having more people use it? The bulk of your professionals would still keep going with their current subscriptions, whilst people who stopped using due to the limitations, or can’t afford to go to the professional level, may now start putting more money into your coffers than you’re currently getting. True! Some pros might downgrade… But, I guess that’s the tradeoff you all will need to figure out.
For what it’s worth, I’ve been using this for 3 days, and I’m loving it, and would happily pay AUD$150/year for infinite workspaces, but have almost zero interest in things like high-res model exports, which means that the AUD$400/year fee is quite painful.
That’s one of the reasons why we have the monthly subscription that you can cancel anytime.